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[CLJ-272] load/ns/require/use overhaul Created: 18/Feb/10  Updated: 06/Jan/17  Resolved: 06/Jan/17

Status: Closed
Project: Clojure
Component/s: None
Affects Version/s: None
Fix Version/s: None

Type: Enhancement Priority: Major
Reporter: Assembla Importer Assignee: Unassigned
Resolution: Declined Votes: 3
Labels: None


Creating this ticket to describe various things people have wanted to change about how ns works:

Minimal needs

  1. there should be a primitive level of loading (presumably load) that just loads without question.
  2. the api should be unified across the ns and direct forms. No more keywords or quoting! So (use foo) not (use 'foo). This makes use et al macros, so there should also be new fn versions (maybe use*).

Other possibilities to discuss.

  1. Feature addressing the :like and :clone ideas from http://onclojure.com/2010/02/17/managing-namespaces/. I think I would prefer a single new option :clone which allows :only and :exclude features as subspecifiers.
  2. Convenience fn to unmap all names in a namespace?

Comment by Assembla Importer [ 24/Aug/10 9:27 AM ]

Converted from http://www.assembla.com/spaces/clojure/tickets/272

Comment by Assembla Importer [ 24/Aug/10 9:27 AM ]

stu said: Suggestions from Volkan Yazici:


I saw your "load/ns/require/use overhaul" ticket[1] and would like to
ask for a few extra overhaulings. I have a project called retop, and
here is its file hiearachy:


In retop.clj, I have below ns definition.

(ns tr.edu.bilkent.cs.retop

And in every .clj file in retop/ directory I have below in-ns in the
very first line.

(in-ns 'tr.edu.bilkent.cs.retop)

The problems with the ns decleration are:

1) Most of the :import's in retop.clj only belong to a single .clj file.
For instance,


imports are only used by graph.clj. Yep, I can add an (import ...)
line just after the (in-ns ...), but wouldn't it be better if I can
specify that in (in-ns ...) form?

2) See (:load ...) clause in (ns ...) form. There are lots of
unnecessary directory prefixes. I'd be prefer something ala Common
Lisp's defpackage:

"packages" ; packages.clj
"util" ; retop/util.clj
"km" ; retop/km.clj
"graph" ; retop/graph.clj
"foo" ; retop/graph/foo.clj
"bar) ; retop/graph/bar.clj
"main")) ; retop/main.clj

Also, being able to use wildcards would be awesome.

3) There are inconsistencies between macros and functions. For instance,

(ns foo.bar.baz (:use mov))
(in-ns 'foo.bar.baz)
(use 'mov)

I'd like to get rid of quotations in both cases.

I'm not sure if I'm using the right tools and doing the right approach
for such a project. But if you agree with the above overhauling
requirements, I'd like to see them appear in the same assembla ticket as

Comment by Assembla Importer [ 24/Aug/10 9:27 AM ]

stuart.sierra said: My requests:

1. If writing macros that do not evaluate their arguments, provide function versions that do evaluate their arguments.

2. Do not support prefix lists for loading Clojure namespaces. It's hard to parse with external tools.

3. Do not conflate importing Java classes with loading Clojure namespaces. They are fundamentally different operations with different semantics.

I have implemented some ideas in a macro called "need" at http://github.com/stuartsierra/need

Comment by Stuart Sierra [ 12/Dec/10 4:08 PM ]

Further requests:

Permit tools to read the "ns" declaration and statically determine the dependencies of a namespace, without evaluating any code.

Comment by Paudi Moriarty [ 28/Feb/12 3:56 AM ]

Permit tools to read the "ns" declaration and statically determine the dependencies of a namespace, without evaluating any code.

This would be great for building OSGi bundles where Bnd is currently not much help.

Comment by Alex Miller [ 06/Jan/17 2:02 PM ]

Just closing as we're not going to work something like this off of a ticket. Not commenting on value of anything here or whether or not we'll do something like this in the future.

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